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– Mr. Narkevičius, how much did it cost to repair the house you live in?
– Depending on what repairs. Because if we look from the beginning, the house has been renovated practically all the time.
– Since 2008, when he held a position of responsibility in the Vilnius city municipality.
– When it was renovated by his parents, the entire renovation cost about 200 thousand. LTL. Less for my calculations.
– And do you have bills that show you have paid?
– I have some accounts, which I managed to find in the family file. Understandably, after 12 years, all the remaining documents had to be reviewed. Because after the parents’ death, the inheritance procedure was complicated and long, lasting approximately 2 years. This question did not arise. So, yes, we found it.
– Do you have accounts here with yourself?
– When I have something, but practically with me – I didn’t take it.
– Can you show
– The time will come – I’ll show you.
– How much do you have accounts?
– Almost like I mentioned.
– Today 160,000 were publicly mentioned in a Delfi publication: you told a journalist that you have 160,000 accounts.
– Let’s just say yes.
– The useful area of your home is more than 200 square meters. m., right?
– Let’s say.
– Today I asked the heads of three construction organizations to calculate 2010. Estimated reconstruction prices. Correct me if I’m wrong: There is an isolated building, a reinforced concrete floor on the second floor …
– No, not reinforced concrete, beams.
– Okay, out of the rafters. The foundations were also fixed, the finish was placed, the ceiling was changed and insulated, the windows were changed, etc. Three builders said different prices, all between 400 and 500 thousand. LTL. The lowest price, without fixing the foundations, was one thousand litas per square meter. The maximum price is 1,600 LTL per square meter, without foundation fixing, floor installation, etc. With all these jobs, around 400-500 thousand. You have accounts for more than a third of the amount. how can you explain this?
– Nothing. I have as much as I have, maybe more to come, I can’t claim it. The work took place 12 years ago, we were part of the work ourselves.
– Did you work on the contract yourself?
– Of course.
– What did you specifically do?
– I can brick, concrete.
– But did you build masonry and concrete?
– No, some, other workers worked.
– Mr. Ribnikov says he is indebted to the job.
– The first thing, if someone gets into debt, it’s not me. Because I inherited in 2016.
– Minister, you lived in that house at the time, it belonged to your parents, who are now dead. You cannot cover yourself with people who cannot defend themselves. You lived in that house. Your parents lived there. Obviously you were busy with home repairs, did you mind …
– Partly yes.
– So who are you covering for?
– There is no need to interpret. One thing is legally correct, another thing is, in fact.
– You formulate that mom rebuilt …
– This is your interpretation. Yes formally …
– But did you really rebuild the house?
– In fact, we live together. What does it mean that I have rebuilt the house? I have lived and I live and of course I have contributed to these works …
– You found the builders, you hired them.
– Let’s just say yes.
– According to Mr. Ribnikov, he has not paid 88 thousand. litas beads. It was written to you, if I’m not mistaken, in 2010. Can you comment on that?
– And yes, and no. I’d first like to point out that we discovered a certain debt two weeks ago when we received a letter from an attorney who in 2015 bought a debt, and this is where the rarity begins, from a company that filed for bankruptcy in 2015, and that bankruptcy began in 2013. or 2012
– You know this happens during bankruptcy proceedings, can you buy debts?
– Manage. Strangely, at the time of the bankruptcy, the insolvency administrator did not provide the plaintiffs with any information and did not initiate recovery if such debts existed at the time.
– Did you know nothing about the bankruptcy administrator? Did you receive no letter, nothing was sent to you?
We absolutely found out 2 weeks ago, a letter was sent to Irena Narkevič.
– For your wife?
– Now you can understand it. Because my wife’s name is the same as my mother’s. My mother, the owner of the house, was Irena Narkevič, my wife was also Irena Narkevič. So the wife did not initially understand what it was about, whether it was a letter to her or not.
– Did you think I could have sent your mother dead?
– Maybe maybe. But there are other heirs, and we will clarify the matter.
– Good OK. You 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 You were a politician. You know the need to rack up bills, as the Prime Minister did when there was a discussion about repairing your home. He held a press conference, showed invoices for the works. You do not have them
– As I said, I have what I have. Maybe there were more of them, it’s hard to say in so long. But there is another point to the question. If, after 10 or 12 years, an alleged debt arises, the question is why it has not been resolved before. Why after the bankruptcy of one company, the appearance of another company, neither the bankruptcy nor the person who bought the debt in 2015? – It is true, it is not clear how much – for five years he did not ask where that debtor is either. Because the bankruptcy administrator practically had to demand it. And then all kinds of questions begin.
– Yes, you have already said it, it is impossible to disagree with that. Well, if the bankruptcy trustee did not apply to you, but only to the one who bought the debt from the administrator, it is probably not normal practice.
– There’s another thing. At the moment, we have seen that, according to the letter we received, Irena Narkevič, it is not clear who, if it is a mother who died in 2013 or a wife, the personal identification code is not there. But there are accounts listed. We started looking at documents from those times, and we saw that there was something interesting. Invoice with serial number SB, etc., number 61, date – October 20, 2010. We saw that we have that account in 2009. on August 31, the same series. But another quantity is indicated. That amount includes payment with the names shown. I have a copy here. Contains a payment order for settlement.
– Can i see how much
– Somewhere 69 thousand. LTL.
– I can see
– There is no need. We will do this in our own time, in appropriate cases. The bottom line is that there are two accounts. An account: with the same number, another date, for the next amount provided by the debt collector. I have a completely different one, with a money order. The question arises as to how many more such accounts can arise.
– Of course, you will find out. As far as I know, his lawyers have resorted to extortion as well as many other things. But, Minister, three experts – you can apply to any independent construction appraiser, etc. – I think it will say the same: the volume of such work – a minimum of 400 thousand. LTL. That is 115-120 thousand. euros The amount you mention for which you have checks (we haven’t seen them, but you said you have them) is almost three times less.
I wouldn’t say that.
– What if you don’t say? This is an expert evaluation.
– In order, there are experts, the evaluation will be, will not be, the fact is that as much as it is currently paid and paid. But why did he keep 10-12 years silent about it? The problem is quite serious.
– It is a serious problem, but there are other serious problems besides this. For example, what Mr. Ribnikov says is that you acted together in a criminal scheme. You, as the responsible official of the municipality, the deputy director of the administration, knew the amounts to which the specific educational institutions that the municipality intends to invest during the renovation process. Then you told him those amounts, he made offers to institutions focusing on that amount, and he often won bids. And settled accounts with you in deeds. You probably don’t have accounts for jobs? Only for some substances?
– The accounts will be subject to the application of the law and will be analyzed. I have already mentioned that everything you have quoted is a person’s saying, and it must be valid. That is one thing. As a result, I appealed to the prosecutor’s office to prove, confirm, and clarify that validity. Because this is the second aspect of this whole matter. As for debts, I think there is recovery between people or not, we will explain. But the accusation in this way is really serious. I went to the prosecutor’s office to clear up these problems.
– Are you saying that company hasn’t done any work for you that you wouldn’t have officially paid for?
– What does it mean officially?
– Well, Mr. Ribnikov says that he paid him through tenders: he tells him where to go, to take taxpayers’ money for renovation projects, he left a tenth of them on the walls of his house.
– Well, if he says it, if someone else says … Every statement must be based on evidence, and I think the police will explain it. Another aspect is that the words he quotes are not true, because when funds are assigned, they are assigned by order of the director …
– He wasn’t talking about dating, but about knowledge. You, as Deputy Director of Administration, knew to whom the administration would give the money, since it was budgeted, you shared with him the information about the tenders in which he would participate, what was the maximum amount and for that he renovated the house.
– This can be interpreted in any way.
– That was fine, wasn’t it?
– No, it certainly wasn’t. Here is the fact. This was not the case. Another thing is that the funds are publicly allocated. For how many institutions, for which jobs are funds allocated, either through the council or by order of the director, the information is public. I worked in the Vilnius city municipality for less than a year and a half. As far as I can remember, there was an attempt to deliver the school renovation by concession … That is not the point. The point is that a large amount has been allocated for the renovation of the schools. That amount was distributed to the institutions according to the relevant criteria and was public information. There are no secrets here. As far as I can remember, that was the case. Therefore, I did not participate in the subsequent course of the process, tender, etc. for those sums.
– Minister, I correctly understand the current situation in which you deny Mr. Ribnikov’s accusations against him that he was grateful for a tenth of the contracts he received for renovating his house. You have provided no evidence that you do not have it, that you have paid all bills according to estimates at the time, and you are simply asking the public to trust you as a negative charge. Such a situation?
– I said what it is and what I have learned in a long time. Perhaps more was paid, I witnessed when the deal was made, and more than once, and with considerable money.
– With whom, with Mr. Ribnikov? With him personally?
– yeah Yes.
– Did you or your mother settle down?
– I had an agreement with my parents and mine. So this process continued.
– Did you pay for the works or materials?
– There are works. Named what works. Includes materials.
– Have you also paid bills with signatures and construction work?
– yeah
– Why don’t you bring them
That is what I have.
– You have brought one that you cannot show.
– For repairs.
– Is it possible to see that account? I will definitely return it.
– Darkart, I say that account and everyone else, there is no secret here, but since there is an example that the account number is one and the amount and date are other, it is obvious that there were several or a dozen accounts for a series. Therefore, something is wrong. And if you’re wrong, the police will clear it up. Maybe there were even more of them? Maybe it didn’t bring the money you received into the treasury, or maybe it led to intentional bankruptcy?
– Minister, let’s say you have accounts for 160 thousand. litas: not shown, but yes. Please explain how 400 thousand. carry out works for an amount of LTL 160 thousand?
– Maybe he paid even more?
– Minister, then you were the deputy director of the municipal administration, you received a state salary, don’t you remember how many thousands it cost to repair your house? 10 thousand – Here, 10 thousand. – there?
– You see, it also appears from that person’s words that there was something paid outsomething was not paid out. Now we see a situation where there is duplication of accounts.
– Minister, you have returned to duplication of accounts.
– This means that something was opaque, something with documents, out of order.
– Could it be that you don’t remember how much, hundreds of thousands or ten thousand litas by mistake, the repair cost you? You’re so rich, don’t you count the money?
– The first thing I repeat repeatedly is that much of the parents’ money was and was liquidated.
– Retired parents. They had accumulated more than 100,000. litas?
– Maybe more. They were quite wealthy before nationalization: there were land sales, there was …
– What do you mean by “before nationalization”?
– When I had land, I had property.
– Until Soviet nationalization, you mean? 1940, 1945?
– Of course. We lived in the same place where the land was … Until now, some place has not been rebuilt.
– So they restored the property, sold the land, and made as much income?
– And not just for that.
– However: 160 thousand. costs, and 400 thousand. – real value. How is that possible?
– You repeat the same question.
– I don’t hear the answer. Because you’re talking about account numbers when I ask you about amounts. Minister, explain how it is possible to rebuild a house for 160 thousand, when your minimum estimate should be 400 thousand. litas? If there is just over 200 squares of usable area.
– I don’t know if 400 or 300 … You’re trying to guess now. The process will show up. Darkart I say that neither we nor our parents should. They settled. This is all I can say.
– Good OK. So how do you assess Mr. Ribnikov’s motivation? What motivates you to start slandering an innocent person?
– Well, here is the third aspect of this question, why these factors start in 12 years. Why an administrator, a debt collector after five years … Although people have not gone anywhere. Father, mother came out anapilin. But the house is located, it was possible to request, provide, in which case? The question here is, were steps taken to hide the company’s activities? I mentioned that there was a duplication of accounts …
– When was the last time you spoke to him?
– Maybe two or a half years ago.
– What were you talking about? About debts?
– No, we are not talking about debts, because there was an attempt to pay a certain debt, which, for example, was granted …
– Who gave it to whom?
– He had given it.
– Debt with him? A loan?
– Let’s say yes. It is not a loan, but not once the funds were lent because the situation with the business was difficult.
– Did you lend him money?
– yeah And we talked, communication was really normal. As he is a builder, we consult and plan what repairs to do … We talk.
– How much money did you lend him?
– He talks about 3,000, but there were more frequent cases of that loan.
– Anyway, do you really remember how much you loaned her? I’m not asking what that debt is talking about.
– Yes, I remember. But it was an informal money transfer, and the way they mentioned … It was.
– How did they transfer each other informally for construction jobs?
– Well, in terms of construction informally … Because I trusted that person, and there was a situation, and some invoices that were issued to other people … Well, it certainly wasn’t.
– So, we heard additional information that you paid and just cashed with Mr. Ribnikov for some work, so you don’t have checks, do you?
– What process are you talking about?
– I asked you about money loans, you said that you borrowed informally, usually without any documents, like when you paid …
– No, so when it is resolved … Well, what are the documents, then there is an agreement …
– Was it established with him only on the basis of the invoices issued?
– I didn’t just pay. I was also a witness when my parents settled.
– But you paid yourself, did you say? At the beginning of the program, did you say that you, the parents and you were the client who organized the whole process?
– Yes, when we lived together, I had my parents’ right of trust and we went through that process together.
– Mr. Ribnikov says you slapped him. I understand that it is not about serving in church during mass, but about sending even the smallest tasks to work without paying for it. You can comment
– Well, what do you call it? If we really want to do some work, we do it and consult with acquaintances. The relationship was such that he really knew about the problems of those construction issues, and we consulted with him on, for example, that topic. I asked how to do one or the other … If we call it send, clap, it’s someone else’s opinion.
– And finally, Minister, you baptized your son. Why are you so angry?
– I don’t know why we get angry or not. The relationship broke two years ago when I started [kalbėti]which is precisely the uncertainty that arose after the borrowed funds should be resolved …
– Did you pay that debt back?
– Let’s say you started doing some of the work we wanted … [Reikėjo nuspręsti]whether we continue or not. And then the uncertainties began.
– In his house?
– Well … We wanted to continue with the next construction, we were looking for who would do it. In the 90s, he had been buying building materials for virtually the entire house, for 30 years. I have materials and blocks for foundations, bricks, etc. And we talked about a possible construction, and it did some of the work. I say, handle it, let’s do it or don’t do it anymore. We form a contract, etc. Or we paid AND then the connection was cut. I tried to speak, to negotiate. If we talk about those things between two people. Because, of course, my wife didn’t want to communicate for any other reason, but she didn’t want to tell personal nuances here. Because it is public information, I avoided involving other people in it … They are not pleasant conversations when very close people, close friends have some family concerns, and it manifests itself that way.
– In your opinion, to whom does the Minister owe?
– I do not know how to treat who owes now. It would not return to the issue of who the client was, who was performing, who was performing and reporting. When I realized that there were some ambiguities, I tried to find out what was going on. But in so many years, I hadn’t known about him that there was some kind of debt, something unregulated, if there was a father here, or mine, or something else … Maybe that’s why it happened during those two years.
But I am interested in another question: why it all started during the six months and the two months when I did not feel any secrets, and all the neighbors were repeatedly interviewed by journalists and others, there were questions from all the organizations about the members of my family. , activities, wealth, what is what is not. All kinds of hooks were searched. And at a time when a person really had to do it, once again, they didn’t want to dig into the details that a business might not be as successful because they probably know that there is another company established … Maybe it is something affected, or for some reason you are forced to say what is currently useful to tell me.
– When will you present those checks? Will it only provide them to law enforcement?
– I have entrusted all this personal question to a lawyer who has some powers, and according to the procedure, I am not a great expert here, those questions will be asked.
– But you, the politician. Minister, you bring the bill and do not let it be seen. You say you have more accounts, but don’t show them. So how can you believe it? Just show what you have.
– There are no secrets. Definitely what I said is this. An example is what I brought. The next thing is to present it to the police, who will evaluate why there is duplication of accounts, etc. That is the reason.
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