An open interview with Dulkis: I am so ashamed, I have spoken of so much strangeness

In Delfi TV’s “Talk” talk, Health Minister Arūnas Dulkys spoke about how he envisioned the position of minister before coming to this position.

“I think it seems easier wherever we are not, the grass is greener behind the fence. Naturally, the cognition is different then. I don’t know if the time of the pandemic gave me the opportunity to get to know each other fully. [šį postą], <...>“because the pandemic prevented people from communicating,” the minister said at the beginning of the program.

Dust: crises come when no one expects

It is true that A. Dulkys, before taking office, knew where he was going and how difficult the situation in Lithuania was in the face of a pandemic. When asked if it was possible to prepare for it, the minister assured that crises would occur when no one was waiting.

“I don’t think so; of course, let’s say that soldiers are prepared for military service and things like that, but it seems to me that real crises come when no one is waiting. The best example is reading about those people who lived on the eve of World War I; like all nations, people believed there would never be a war. Prizes were even awarded to economists who convinced themselves with their scientific evidence that war was not possible on this earth at all, because Economic ties were so tangled and there would never be anything here, but unfortunately we had two of the most brutal world wars, and it showed that man, his values ​​much more difficult, ”commented A. Dulkys.

The minister says that when he was offered the position, he felt a sense of civic duty.

“We have to understand that there will always be situations where you make a decision in a few seconds, whether you go or not. And there will never be a way to win. There will always be situations where the sense of citizenship” pops up. ” that a civic approach was boiling over and, if necessary, okay, I will go as far as I can, contributing. That was the mood, “added the minister.

Leaders problems

Speaking of leadership, the Minister of Health assured that today’s leaders face very different problems and challenges than before.

“I doubt that any other politician would have seduced and tempted me into politics, but the current prime minister is a man whose word was decisive in this case. Oh, when it comes to leaders, the leaders of the 21st century are changing; What Churchill or others needed a hundred years ago is all that is changing, and 21st century leadership is first and foremost moral, because now people have to improve not so much the tools as themselves. And the leadership of the 21st century already requires a holistic approach on the part of leaders when it is said that the most important thing is the person. When it is said that a person must take care, he must take care not only of those who are close to us today, but also of the future. This means that if I think about the development of the organization, in its travel in time, I have to think that it would be good not only for the people who work at that time, but those future people would also like to work. This place is very complicated, ”said A. Dulkys on the show.

In terms of responsibility, the pandemic, as noted in the show, revealed a sense of responsibility not only for leaders but also for society.

“Apparently, the reproach would be of a series of those stones: whoever did not make mistakes, throw a stone at me. It seems to me that we can blame each other a lot, but we also have something to be thankful for. Almost half of the people already have contributed to the creation of public goods and have been vaccinated, they understand the responsibility; This is the point: many people need to be vaccinated not only for themselves, because many can get sick and nothing happens, but if we think about the person around us , that’s the real responsibility, “said A. Dulkys on the show.

Dust: In a sense, a pandemic is a good example

The politician even added that, in a sense, a pandemic is a good example of how we can deal with the crisis.

“When there is a crisis, when everyone needs to contribute, it will be wrong for everyone to think ‘nothing is going to happen to me.’ Everyone’s contribution is very important. I think that in a certain sense and well that pandemic, because we will know ourselves when there are other crises. After all, we think better of ourselves, and now we can see in our photography what we are: how quickly we succeed or fail to do something. As the saying goes, there is nothing wrong with going wrong. It is a good practical example of how we can reach an agreement. “

According to the interlocutor, it is still difficult to understand that collective crises must be tackled for everyone, rather than waiting for someone else to solve those problems.

“It just came to our attention then. We talk about wars, a longer period of peace is forgotten, the same happens with stock brokers, it takes a year and we have a misunderstanding again, stock market crisis. Man is irrational, always he is tempted to think: “Maybe I don’t contribute, but the problem has to be solved, maybe others will, and then I’ll take advantage of it.”

“Sometimes it is thought that maybe a neighbor is going to get vaccinated and everything will be fine, but here there is already a high price, because we are playing with people’s lives and it is completely ridiculous,” added A. Dulkys.

System changes are needed

When asked about vaccines and why people are slow to get vaccinated, politicians have argued that people in power are also responsible, but systemic change takes a long time.

“It seems to me that the problem is that in politics, in various positions, there are many leaders who are afraid of losing power, jobs, and who unconsciously get involved in certain games, balancing interests, then what the State needs to combine with the fear of losing what they have. I have said before that I really am not afraid of losing anything, I know that together it is a strength when everyone around you knows that you are not afraid, and that is very important. This helps to make decisions, but it is difficult to make them when the whole system is very complex, when some coherence is needed, because even now, in the area that I am in, I have to deal with the management of the pandemic at the same time. and change the system. In some things we do not get along, because the system has not changed and we do not get along.

But then the system seems to respond that change during a pandemic is wrong, reforms are intimidating and a kind of stalemate arises, and the demand for leadership is immediate and immediate. It is too quick a wish, because systemic change takes time, and it is also necessary to understand that some things will be told ‘no’, but it is difficult to say. So here’s the point: fear of losing your job, “says the politician.

Ingrained mobbing and intimidation

When asked if there were any unpleasant events at the post, the minister said he was very surprised by the entrenched mobbing.

“We consulted with relatives, although there was little time to consult. I am very proud of my children: my daughters understood well, we knew what the rules of the game were here, and they accept it as a game; <...> I am not afraid of losing anything, I understand that you cannot change everything in one period, but someone has to try to lay the foundations. The children understand that now there will be everything, my family is civic, I am proud of it.

My family understands the rules of the game and I understand it, but that does not mean that I agree with them. I find it strange that in Lithuania some politicians allow themselves to be symbols of the same mobbing or bullying; we ask <...> from where in the institutions, in the schools so much bullying, let’s see how some politicians conduct their meetings, how they behave themselves during those meetings, how they greet the participants, what and in what phrases they accompany. It’s really no wonder where there is bullying and harassment in organizations if you repeat and repeat. I mean, you have to deal intellectually, but not so primitively, humiliation, ”says the politician.

According to him, it is sad when politicians use mobbing in power and then, after losing their position, they use everything in the organizations they move to.

“Regarding his work, he often doesn’t make any specific comments, for example about the law, but he appeals to you and even says phrases like ‘he’s shy’, ‘he’s afraid of violating the public procurement law’, ‘look, It is afraid to come, it is hidden. “Actually, everyone knows how it works, but an example. Here are the roots, this is how mobbing is born. When these people are no longer politicians, but leaders of some organizations, then they will use the same there ”, says the politician.

He spoke of the future and the shame of the first few months

At the end of the program, the minister was asked if he had any ambitions to remain in power after the term. The politician said he had little idea of ​​how his career would continue.

“Good question. I still haven’t learned to shut up what shouldn’t be said. I admit that at the time I was invited, I didn’t think about these things at all. For me, it was analogous to” come on, it helps, because the water flooded in somewhere. “I saw the situation that way, and now let’s see (I don’t want to offend anyone): there are a lot of advisers since the first wave of the fight. The scale of the problems of the first wave of fighting, the numbers are similar to The current ones, the peak is similar, and now we think that the pandemic has calmed down. What happened then? I was concentrating on that.

I thought: well, someone sees that the team needs you. Feeling good when they need you and I came to contribute, I didn’t think about the future. The second lesson is that in the first few months I have said in more than one interview that, you know, I am not a politician. Now I understand what nonsense you were talking about, after all, my dear, it is the post of minister and there is politics. It is a shame for me that in the first months I feel so much spoken strangeness, because at that time and in my personal life there were all kinds of circumstances, a completely different state of mind. So now I have no answer [dėl valdžios siekimo ateityje, aut. past.]”- say the politicians.

“I don’t know where that life will take me. I have a formula for myself that I start every business day as the last,” commented A. Dulkys at the end of the program.